Please let me know what problem you have.
Windows 10/11 stuttering when fTPM = enabled. AMD confirmed bug and planned resolution.
- Thread starter br40
- Start date
Hello, the problem is about the known issue with stuttering in Win 11 when the fTPM is enabled. I am asking a proper fix in the BIOS to be available to anybody owning an HX90, like I do.
Thanks.
tom kenzzy
Member
HM80 users need for new BIOS, too.
Attachments
@joey, do you need any other information? I am sorry to push on that, but I really would like to avoid waiting for additional 10 days to have something back from you.
Carbon fib'er
Well-Known Member
Minisforum just offered me $40 USD if I'll change my Amazon review. I wanted to reply and suggest they use that money to fix their very OBVIOUS support problem. But, it's obvious they don't care, or are immune to such reasoning. I think good-faith gestures like that would be a wasted effort (because they're operating in bad faith, and know it).
What was interesting is that the review was for an HX90 I bought from a reseller. The two negative points I made were 1) Minisforum offloads support to resellers (telling people "contact your seller for support" as if Minisforum doesn't support Minisforum computers sold in bulk to resellers.). Part of the deal with resellers is that they're apparently buying the obligation to support those machines. Customers don't know that until they seek support.
2) The obvious antipathy Minisforum holds for the bios (and customers generally), how there's been at least two significant AMD AGESA firmware updates, and Minisforum acts offended that anyone would want them (long after other computer makers made those bios updates available).
I thought #1 interesting because the reseller must have brought my review to Minisforum's attention. Suddenly, instead of this being between me and the reseller (as Minisforum communicates to people here), it's Minisforum waving $40 USD at me (a "dear friend"). The email ended with the common "Our dedicated team of engineers provide lifetime technical service and try our best to resolve any issues with the product, so please contact us first and we will take care of it."
To be clear, I'm not mad. It's not personal. I just think people should know what they're buying (lousy support, double-talk, a quickly back-leveled bios). Apparently, Minisforum will spend $40 USD to prevent people from knowing (instead of providing decent support, straight talk that matches the clarity of their advertising, and timely bios updates). They'll send you to the reseller if they can. If the reseller complains to Minisforum, you're suddenly the happy recipient of a "rebate."
What was interesting is that the review was for an HX90 I bought from a reseller. The two negative points I made were 1) Minisforum offloads support to resellers (telling people "contact your seller for support" as if Minisforum doesn't support Minisforum computers sold in bulk to resellers.). Part of the deal with resellers is that they're apparently buying the obligation to support those machines. Customers don't know that until they seek support.
2) The obvious antipathy Minisforum holds for the bios (and customers generally), how there's been at least two significant AMD AGESA firmware updates, and Minisforum acts offended that anyone would want them (long after other computer makers made those bios updates available).
I thought #1 interesting because the reseller must have brought my review to Minisforum's attention. Suddenly, instead of this being between me and the reseller (as Minisforum communicates to people here), it's Minisforum waving $40 USD at me (a "dear friend"). The email ended with the common "Our dedicated team of engineers provide lifetime technical service and try our best to resolve any issues with the product, so please contact us first and we will take care of it."
To be clear, I'm not mad. It's not personal. I just think people should know what they're buying (lousy support, double-talk, a quickly back-leveled bios). Apparently, Minisforum will spend $40 USD to prevent people from knowing (instead of providing decent support, straight talk that matches the clarity of their advertising, and timely bios updates). They'll send you to the reseller if they can. If the reseller complains to Minisforum, you're suddenly the happy recipient of a "rebate."
mdes
Member
@joey Please, tell us what the actual problem you are having since you are not fixing your BIOS according to AMD recommendations?
- The guy who developed the BIOS is gone?
- You are not able to correct your BIOS? (lack of technicians, bad design and/or implementation of your BIOS…)
- You have lost the source code of the BIOS?
- You don't want to support your customers?
- Something else…?
Oh my God! That is really embarrassing.
@joey, is that the way MF treats its customers? And even the fact that you do not reply to your customers here is not polite. You make a question, we answer and then you disappear. But really do you think that is the right way to behave?
tom kenzzy
Member
You mean, other manufacturers such as Lenovo, Dell, ASUS, Toshiba, HP and so on do release new bios easily without passing the test?
What does that mean? You are testing it? The BIOS is not passing the tests? You are working on that? And which tests?
Carbon fib'er
Well-Known Member
Two hours later, in a new thread:
Thank you, Joey! I wish this could have been done more enthusiastically/supportively. We're not your enemies. (If you're going to end up doing it, why not engage more positively from the beginning? What's the point of making it a frustrating experience for months? I can understand that bioses don't occur overnight. But, that was never the message through all this. There's always a deep antipathy to the bios. I don't understand why. Users get frustrated for months, for what reason? If you're going to provide a bios, why not be cheerful about it, explanatory, and reap the reward from delighted customers? It's like you got the worst of both worlds. Offended customers, and you gave the bios anyway. Why conduct support that way?).
[EDIT: @br40 @JSN0 , This appears to be the same bios Joey provided privately (earlier in this thread). This one is installs through a uefi shell, not a .exe from within Windows. But, the ARMH5.rom file has the same checksum: ec473321b21ee55f33391f17e1b222d7 ARMH5.rom]
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Carbon fib'er
Well-Known Member
My guess is that they have to pay the motherboard maker for bios updates. After installing the surprise new version, the bios name changed from "American Megatrends" to "Besstar Tech." I'm thinking Besstar bought the AMI bios, and resold it to Minisforum. It's probably "bootleged" that way, not officially licensed to Minisforum.
I don't know. But, Besstar makes a lot of these mini computers. Maybe Minisforum buys those and rebrands them. Maybe the same way Minisforum offloads support to resellers (like Coofun), telling owners who bought from a reseller to go to the seller for support. Maybe Minisforum is in a relationship like that with Besstar, and has to pay more for a bios update from them.
It's hard to say when this kind of flim-flammery exists. Maybe Besstar buys from Minisforum, rebrands, and makes their own bios updates because they have more conscientious support (and Minisforum buys the bios updates back from them?). It could be anything. But, the way it started with an official-looking bios, and turned into brand-name soup... I think there's some kind of bootlegging going on. (I could be wrong. It's hard to interpret things positively when you see so much weird stuff. I automatically think the bios update's pedigree is less than official.).
[EDIT: Googling the company names, both besstar and minisforum are listed at the exact same address.]
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@br40 Can you please share links to the exe bios install package since the one provide by MF requires manual intervention which can be a hit or miss! I would be thankful if someone puts instructions on the procedure to install the fix and what steps to follow for the drivers update (Windows drivers). Thanks for providing insights about this issue
from the private message, MF posted Bios download link:
https://www.mediafire.com/file/zamq66p7rzx8et6/HX_220928.zip/file
Per MF private mesage--
"Update method:
In the Windows system, unzip the downloaded bios file in the desktop folder, and then run the BAT file with administrator privileges. The script will run automatically.
Note: After the bios is updated, it cannot be downgraded. The update process should not be interrupted or powered off. Otherwise, it will cause no startup, thank you"
Those steps cover the BIOS update installation. (Before installing the BIOS, I'd recommend doing a fresh reboot, exiting any background/auto-start apps, and disable any active virus protection...since those have potential to interfere w/ successful installation.)
As for the steps to follow for the drivers update, I think those were fairly well spelled out in my post that you had quoted. (Let me know if you have specific questions about anything I had said.) I should note, however, given the "rolling" nature of Windows Update and the lapsed between my post and today... there may be different updates available than what I had posted. You may have to do some educated guessing if that's the case. [Err on the conservative side -- only install driver updates, if you notice instability or something not working correctly... and/or you have "unknown" devices listed in device manager.]
I haven't really been engaging this thread further out of frustration with the way MF conducts itself. I had also found similar connections b/w besstar and mf when doing my own investigation some months back, and I drew similar conclusions as @Carbon fib'er. I'm both a tech enthusiast & IS/IT professional and have obviously been patient and willing to give some latitude waiting for proper firmware update/support... but this arguably simple request was (and is still) so poorly handled by mf that I'm 100% never buying another of their products again.
I'm literally only casually monitoring this thread in case I can assist fellow
Thanks for responding back. I was worried that the topic gone staled. As I mentioned, I am avoiding doing an update through the adhoc approach that was suggested in the mf post. I have disabled Windows optional updates to avoid issues with drivers, hope its a wise decision
The reason I wanted this update is because I am building a Blue Iris setup and issues with video or audio would make it unpleasant experience. Anyhow, thanks and appreciate your support...
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I also have this stuttering issue along with static sounds during the stuttering. I have loaded the new BIOS Update (Sep 2022), and it did not resolve the issue. Update: I just removed the back plate from the unit and removed the hard drive caddy. Inspected all parts and replaced the Caddy. Ensured screws were tight and wires were routed so they could not be pinched.. Replaced the back plate in the proper orientation and ensured the short screw was in correct location. Tightened all screws and started it back up. The static noise is gone, stuttering remains.
Update 2: After running the new BIOS a couple days, I agree with dffactory, the stuttering is significantly less, but once in a while they do appear.
Update 2: After running the new BIOS a couple days, I agree with dffactory, the stuttering is significantly less, but once in a while they do appear.
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I also updated to the "new" BIOS, I can confirm that the stuttering is significantly less, but once in a while they do appear. Not as bad as before, and since the update last week only ~2x but I noticed them. I would strongly suggest @joey to create an official BIOS support page for HX90 and keep us updated. I recommended your device to 3 people, but if this is not going to be addressed for when we migrate to Windows 11, we will all move to another hardware and never look back.
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Mithrandir
Member
What about UM700? I try everything. Turn off fTPM, ryzenadj script, even bought a new ssd. But the problem still continues. I'm really tired and bored.
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#1.
It costs almost nothing for Minisforum to create a support page for new BIOS versions.
I do not understand why it has to be so painful to discover BIOS updates for the hardware they sell.
#2.
If the new BIOS doesn't fix the stutter, then there is no point in taking the risk upgrading it.
If possible, simply disable the TPM in BIOS. This should solve the issue for most Linux users.
It costs almost nothing for Minisforum to create a support page for new BIOS versions.
I do not understand why it has to be so painful to discover BIOS updates for the hardware they sell.
#2.
If the new BIOS doesn't fix the stutter, then there is no point in taking the risk upgrading it.
If possible, simply disable the TPM in BIOS. This should solve the issue for most Linux users.
Mithrandir
Member
Unfortunately this method did not work for me. I'm using win 11 ftpm is turned off and the problem still exists.